Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

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Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

[Grognard]_Arjan

[Grognard]_Arjan: Général de brigade; Nombre de messages: 690
Age: 23
Localisation: la Hollande
Date d'inscription: 17/11/2006

Message n°1

Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [Grognard]_Arjan le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 18:03

Hey Grogs,
Here a new thread to discuss new idead and bring up ideas.
My first question is: What time do we want to be the Grognard mod in? As soon as it is possible to change un its, will we make it an Napoleonic mod or should we stick to the ETW age. If so i would like to change some units to the Dutch faction, and other factions when i get books on them.

Admiral: Capitaine; Nombre de messages: 205
Age: 24
Localisation: Kiev,Ukraine
Date d'inscription: 17/10/2008

Message n°2

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par Admiral le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 18:42

Nice question.

To my mind it depends on whether Lords will be making NTW 3 or not. If they WILL make it., creating another napoleonic mod would be a bit useless. If they won't, I'd prefer Napoleonic Realism Mod .Realism here means not only due uniforms, but also small pretty things like adding pipers , trumpleters or other musitians, giving some factions 2 flag-bearers per infantry batallion and so on.

If Lords decide to make NTW3, sticking to ETW would be mostly preferable, but the scale of work to be done is simply huge.Changing units is perfect idea any way, and even though I cant actually make textures or 3D models, i'll share /or find necesary information with great pleasure ^^ What I would also like in that case is adding Ukraine which actually existed as a state untill 1775 :pirat:

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I: Général de division; Nombre de messages: 3855
Age: 26
Localisation: Fontainebleau
Date d'inscription: 03/04/2007

Message n°3

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [Grognard]_Jean-Charles I le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 18:50

I think we should not go napoleonic for ou mods : here are some reasons :

- The way the english community and the Lordz replied to our mod was quite cold. Most saw it as a coup. So if we make a Napoleonic mod, it's not sure we would be able to play it with the commnity. We don't have the prestige and skills of the Lordz. So, I say, we don't take teh challenge ( yet ). My opinion is, the remainings of the "Lordz" are dead-cold-meat and they wont release anything before a long, long time. Let's see what they do.
- Going napoleonic, means editing skinns, which I cannot do. We'd need some experienced folk.
- Sticking to ETW requires less effort, and much has already been done with the "Gorgnard_Mod"
- Grognard mod now only has to be slightly improved, according to AARs from grognards and LEGIO.
- Next step to Grognard Mod, is , I believe, to make it compatible to campaign. This would spread our audience, because most people only play solo. Darth Vador Mod, which fix many problems in-game and in-campaign could be added easily to the Grognard Mod for campaign, resulting in the best up-to-date mod about ETW.
- Reskinning, by only setting new colours and textures, rather than creating new models, takes less time.
- It seems some ambiance mod, music, blood, etc can be easily implemented to create a mod
- Last but not least, I don't know how to create an installation program. I need to learn.

Question is : are you wishing to participate ? Did you already try 1.c

Thank you for having created the thread :heart:

_________________
Quand on veut, on peut ...

Mais quand on peut : ON DOIT !

- Napoléon Ier

de Monteynard: Capitaine; Nombre de messages: 178
Age: 23
Localisation: Slovenie
Date d'inscription: 16/03/2009

Message n°4

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par de Monteynard le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 19:43

I reply in English since it looks like this whole thread has become English dominated (if the Grognards wish me to translate my text, I will happily do so).

Quite frankly Jean-Charles, I cannot agree with you here. The Lordz are dead, that is what they have created their own game studio and haven't updated for Medieval II. Unless we are talking about different Lordz's?

This game has not seen a month of life and yet there are already so many mods around. Seeing the rate of progress, I believe we are not that far from a comprehensive "editor" which will enable us to add new models or animations, although I believe this will not be necessary.

Why add new models? All we need are uniforms. Although warfare changed in one hundred years, it would still be fare more sensible not to twiddle too much until the game is relatively patched. We already have a member which is able to do uniforms, who says more won't join or help in the moding community. Since this game is already set in the gunpowder era, it will be less arduous to just change the looks, would it not.

I do however agree with you on the fact that the Grognard mod should for now be a centrepiece of our community, and maybe it will even become something which the community will like to play. I am also not very sure the response has been cold, it is just that people need to get adjusted to the feel of a new game, as I have said, Empire has yet to have its one month anniversary.

Many mods are born from several small ones, why should Napoleon be any different? There is one more thing to remember. CA will surely make an expansion pack, yet in what era and when exactly is yet to be revealed to us (unless one of us is a new Nostradamus capable of seeing a PC game's future).

Edit: Je me sens sale d'écrire en anglais dans un forum français. Embarassed

Embarassed

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I: Général de division; Nombre de messages: 3855
Age: 26
Localisation: Fontainebleau
Date d'inscription: 03/04/2007

Message n°5

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [Grognard]_Jean-Charles I le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 20:02

[Grognard]_de Monteynard a écrit:

Quite frankly Jean-Charles, I cannot agree with you here. The Lordz are dead, that is what they have created their own game studio and haven't updated for Medieval II. Unless we are talking about different Lordz's?

Edit: Je me sens sale d'écrire en anglais dans un forum français.

Yes, actually these are not the Lordz we knew. The best ones have created TheLordz Studio and are aiming at creating their own game. they've been working on it. The remaining Lordz might be still good, they are not what they once were. When we posted two weeks ago we would be happy to help creating a mod, me and articho, what happened ? Gunner24 (newly promoted Lordz ( I can tell you this does not add much prestige to the Lordz at all)) started at once to attack our views on what should be done... And nothing was done... Articho was contacted ... To create a font and/or a bannier ? That was not far from the insult, and it is anyways coldness.

That's why I started creating the mod, just to give it a try.

Now read what they say Smile

Smile

Lord Gunner24 a écrit:
Modding is barely possible currently, and even if tools will be released, it's going to be hard and long.
Modding ain't easy, I can promise you that.

I thought the same as the quote above, but the Grogs have already done a part "mod" of stats and costs....how they did it so quickly - I don't know.

_________________
Quand on veut, on peut ...

Mais quand on peut : ON DOIT !

- Napoléon Ier

de Monteynard: Capitaine; Nombre de messages: 178
Age: 23
Localisation: Slovenie
Date d'inscription: 16/03/2009

Message n°6

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par de Monteynard le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 20:17

Si les nouveaux Lordz ne veulent pas travailler avec nous et comme ils ne sont pas apparemment digne de leur nom, nous les Grognards vont faire tout ce qui est nécessaire pour donner à la communauté un visage d'un vrai mod napoléonien si nous sommes capables de créer un vrai mod digne de NTW2.

Chapeau à toi Jean-Charles et tout ceux qui ont déjà assisté créer le mod Grognard et à ceux qui vont le faire.

Braindead Colonel

Braindead Colonel: Membre Honoraire; Nombre de messages: 120
Date d'inscription: 27/10/2007

Message n°7

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par Braindead Colonel le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 20:59

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I a écrit:
- The way the english community
and the Lordz replied to our mod was quite cold. Most saw it as a coup.

Cold? I even spoke to you on msn and suggested you mention your mod on the forums.

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I a écrit:
Yes, actually these are not the Lordz we knew. The best ones have created TheLordz Studio and are aiming at creating their own game. they've been working on it. The remaining Lordz might be still good, they are not what they once were.

Yes, we are not the Lordz Game Studio. Unlike them we make mods, for free, just for fun.

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I a écrit:
When we posted two weeks ago we would be happy to help creating a mod, me and articho, what happened ? Gunner24 (newly promoted Lordz ( I can tell you this does not add much prestige to the Lordz at all))

Gunner24 has made tons of maps for ntw2. What exactly have you made that's even close to his contributions?

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I a écrit:Articho was contacted ... To create a font and/or a bannier ? That was not far from the insult, and it is anyways coldness

Yes. I heard that you were interested on working on a napoleonic mod (before you started your own thing, so I suggested to articho that he could try making some simple 2-d art. We will not commit to anything with him, or anyone else, before he proves he will do work (We once asked him to make a backdrop, took him half a year to make a sketch that we couldn't use). Not that articho is not talented, he is quite an artist, but he doesn't have enough free time apparently to help us.

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I a écrit:
My opinion is,
the remainings of the "Lordz" are dead-cold-meat and they wont release
anything before a long, long time. Let's see what they do.

Us remaining Lordz don't have to prove anything, we've done serious worke before (5 complete factions for NTW2) and will continue working at our own pace. It's about having fun for us anyway. Smile

Smile

P.S. Do change my account (honourary membership), I will have nothing to do with the grognards clan.

You are welcome to post about any mod in our forums, www.thelordz.org. But be advised, we will not put up with similar rude comments there. merci!

[Grognard]_Kettch

[Grognard]_Kettch: Général de division; Nombre de messages: 1392
Age: 24
Date d'inscription: 25/09/2006

Message n°8

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [Grognard]_Kettch le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 21:06

Super j'ai l'impression qu'on va encore se faire des amis...

[N]Badger: Soldat; Nombre de messages: 8
Age: 35
Localisation: Ghent, Belgique
Date d'inscription: 27/09/2007

Message n°9

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [N]Badger le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 21:28

Bonsoir a tous,

Je vais essayer de m'exprimer en francais, ca a été longtemps :D

Je trouve que l'effort fait par JC est vraiment très belle et vous avez surement investé tellement d'heures dans cette bijoux.

Editer les stats est pour le moment la seule modification qu'on peut faire sur etw, en les efforts comme le Grognard mod sont deja une belle experiment qui va nous rendre de l'information utile pour faire les mechanisations du jeu plus realistique.

Les Lordz sont quand même interessé de faire un mod Napoleonic, qui est a ce moment vraiment impossible a faire ou de dire si a sera possible tout court. je suis d'opinion que c'est dans cet point de vue que gunner a fait son replique. On peut donc pas dire si on va faire un mod pour ce jeu.

Si on a plus de clareté sur ce sujet, on peut de nouveau parler d'une coöperation sur ce sujet.

En espérant de ne pas avoir trop salé votre forum francais avec mon francais flamand, je vous prie d'accepter mes salutations distinguées Wink

Wink

B

[Grognard]_Arjan

[Grognard]_Arjan: Général de brigade; Nombre de messages: 690
Age: 23
Localisation: la Hollande
Date d'inscription: 17/11/2006

Message n°10

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [Grognard]_Arjan le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 21:56

Well what i for one want to do, is add more different units to the Dutch Republic army. I have several books on the army and even did a paper for my study. I think as soon as it possible, that we should change units and nations where possible. For the moment only the Brits and French have a large amount of unique units. In the Dutch army even non unique units, like hussars are missing. The Dutch republic even had full regiment hussars, trained on own ground \, next to all the 'hired' ones in germany.
And we should do the same on all units. But this will take time ofcourse. It's not something that has to be done right away but i was mainly wondering how far we want to go with this mod.

[Grognard]_Arjan

[Grognard]_Arjan: Général de brigade; Nombre de messages: 690
Age: 23
Localisation: la Hollande
Date d'inscription: 17/11/2006

Message n°11

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [Grognard]_Arjan le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 22:14

Well, the only messages we got from the lordz, and mainly the new member Gunner24, was that you guys want to wait till CA gives anymore clarity. But if you take a look around you would find that CA isnt really that of a help at all.
Then JC turns up with a good idea, suprised us all and really did some work and all we get is: I'ts probaly an all out French Charge mod...
Any offers for participation are pushed away or put on the long track untill word from CA. All we, and i should actually say JC, because most of the grogs only did testing, did was make a good start, a good base where a possible NTW3 could really benefit from.
Or isnt NTW2 gameplay without Fire in melee the desired goal anymore?

P.S. Do change my account (honourary membership), I will have nothing to do with the grognards clan.

You are welcome to post about any mod in our forums, www.thelordz.org. But be advised, we will not put up with similar rude comments there. merci!

And this quote is jsut one example of the real coldness towards our clan thats be going on for years now. And why? Because we own you guys, even in your own silly gm on rules.The one reason we are becoming more rude towards the community is because more and more of the community is shitting on us. And it's been going on for too long.

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I: Général de division; Nombre de messages: 3855
Age: 26
Localisation: Fontainebleau
Date d'inscription: 03/04/2007

Message n°12

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [Grognard]_Jean-Charles I le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 22:30

Braindead Colonel a écrit:

Us remaining Lordz don't have to prove anything, we've done serious worke before (5 complete factions for NTW2) and will continue working at our own pace. It's about having fun for us anyway.

P.S. Do change my account (honourary membership), I will have nothing to do with the grognards clan.

You are welcome to post about any mod in our forums, www.thelordz.org. But be advised, we will not put up with similar rude comments there. merci!

Even if I were a bit rude, it's no reason to get angry or offended as you do. No one had told we would remove your honorary membership yet. But if that's your decision, after just one post that did not say only good things about you, I think it would say long about how poorly you think about the Grognards (And what you just said before went into this direction). Anyways, I'm not here to judge you, and you to judge us. If I used the term dead-cold-meat, I am alone responsible, and the aim was not to offend you. Concerning Gunner24, I have nothing personal against him, but I was really surprised he became a Lordz. ( Some other people expressed this view on the Lordz forum, and they were not answered as crudely as you did).

Quote: Hokomoko

Originally Posted by JC_von_Preussen

This mod was meant to be released on the Lordz forum, you guessed it

better that it was released here, so it is clear it was not created by the Lordz.

Perhaps that's not cold for an answer, at least it was not very warm.

_________________
Quand on veut, on peut ...

Mais quand on peut : ON DOIT !

- Napoléon Ier

Admiral: Capitaine; Nombre de messages: 205
Age: 24
Localisation: Kiev,Ukraine
Date d'inscription: 17/10/2008

Message n°13

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par Admiral le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 22:42

It's definitely sad to read some parts of the previous post.If we all worked together we could achieve much, much more.

Personally I see nothing that stops beginning of Mod-creating process given that we already can change unit skins and change main unit's stats. What else do u need? We have absolutely all necesary unit types and animations, so the only thing we have to do is just to mod skins and main parameters.

Should other members of honourable community disagree that statement , they are mostly welcomed to explain what else would they like to implemet. Discussion is always more welcomed then silly useless quarreling.

Admiral: Capitaine; Nombre de messages: 205
Age: 24
Localisation: Kiev,Ukraine
Date d'inscription: 17/10/2008

Message n°14

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par Admiral le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 22:54

And some thoughts on Mod itself.

First of all it could be a good idea to modify the most awfull parts of the game :

1) Sieges. Those crazy soldiers climbing on a walls like ninjas just make me mad. I wonder if it's possible to return ladders to the game. If it is, it would be wise to make cannon bombardment and escalade only possible ways to cross the walls ( as in reality).

2)Cavalery is just awful. I'm a mostly cavalery general, however I never use cavalery in ETW. They're all the same exept dragoons, and all of them are totally useless. Cuirassiers, lancers and all other types. They could be made stronger in mellee and charge and not THAT fast.

3)Units morale generally. Dunno, you guys could have already done it in MOD so I wont speak on this.

And what I would like to finish with is that I'm now convinced we should make Napoleonic-MOD only. But that should be not Grognards Mod , neither should it be Lordz Mod or KO-s mod. It should be Napoleonic community's MOD and everyone should take part. Because If Napoleonic community wont make good Napoleonic Mod, noone else will.

Dernière édition par [Grognard]_Admiral le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 23:05, édité 1 fois

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I: Général de division; Nombre de messages: 3855
Age: 26
Localisation: Fontainebleau
Date d'inscription: 03/04/2007

Message n°15

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [Grognard]_Jean-Charles I le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 23:04

[Grognard]_Admiral a écrit:And some thoughts on Mod itself.

First of all it could be a good idea to modify the most awfull parts of the game :

1) Sieges. Those crazy soldiers climbing on a walls like ninjas just make me mad. I wonder if it's possible to return ladders to the game. If it is, it would be wise to make cannon bombardment and escalade only possible ways to cross the walls ( as in reality).

2)Cavalery is just awful. I'm a mostly cavalery general, however I never use cavalery in ETW. They're all the same exept dragoons, and all of them are totally useless. Cuirassiers, lancers and all other types. They could be made stronger in mellee and charge and not THAT fast.

3)Units morale generally. Dunno, you guys could have already done it in MOD so I wont speak on this.

About Siege, good idea, we should ork on it.
About cav ===> Try the mod :| :|

_________________
Quand on veut, on peut ...

Mais quand on peut : ON DOIT !

- Napoléon Ier

JP: Général de brigade; Nombre de messages: 2612
Age: 47
Localisation: Evian-Haute-Savoie
Date d'inscription: 20/10/2008

Message n°16

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par JP le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 23:28

I see that the discussion is lovely on some posts, human nature is
not perfect, it is easy to criticize or make negative views on others work.
JC Von Preussen took the balls to address the modding and made a mini mod which is a success. The aim is to make the game more realistic and not seek glory.
When people who are not satisfied with the work of an novice such as JC in this area, do not release their frustrations.

Apart from that I am glad that the mod will be even more realistic with the additional changes, thank you for your work JC.

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I

[Grognard]_Jean-Charles I: Général de division; Nombre de messages: 3855
Age: 26
Localisation: Fontainebleau
Date d'inscription: 03/04/2007

Message n°17

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [Grognard]_Jean-Charles I le Dim 22 Mar 2009 - 23:53

[N]Badger a écrit:Bonsoir a tous,

Je vais essayer de m'exprimer en francais, ca a été longtemps :D

Je trouve que l'effort fait par JC est vraiment très belle et vous avez surement investé tellement d'heures dans cette bijoux.

Editer les stats est pour le moment la seule modification qu'on peut faire sur etw, en les efforts comme le Grognard mod sont deja une belle experiment qui va nous rendre de l'information utile pour faire les mechanisations du jeu plus realistique.

Les Lordz sont quand même interessé de faire un mod Napoleonic, qui est a ce moment vraiment impossible a faire ou de dire si a sera possible tout court. je suis d'opinion que c'est dans cet point de vue que gunner a fait son replique. On peut donc pas dire si on va faire un mod pour ce jeu.

Si on a plus de clareté sur ce sujet, on peut de nouveau parler d'une coöperation sur ce sujet.

En espérant de ne pas avoir trop salé votre forum francais avec mon francais flamand, je vous prie d'accepter mes salutations distinguées

B

Merci, et désolé de ne répondre à ton message que maintenant, tout le monde a été surpris par la réaction de BDC.

Our aim never was to create the best mod ever, it was really to give it a try. If I or we can be helpful, it would be a pleasure to work with you.

Always a pleasure to discuss with you. Dankjewel !

_________________
Quand on veut, on peut ...

Mais quand on peut : ON DOIT !

- Napoléon Ier

[Grognard]_Liberalis

[Grognard]_Liberalis: Chef d’État-Major; Nombre de messages: 4683
Age: 28
Localisation: Kremlin, Russie
Date d'inscription: 23/09/2006

Message n°18

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [Grognard]_Liberalis le Lun 23 Mar 2009 - 0:57

Ok people, calm down please, we are on this together. We can all express our opinions gently.

Why are you saying the following BDC ?

BDC a écrit:Gunner24 has made tons of maps for ntw2. What exactly have you (JC) made that's even close to his contributions?

Well isn't he modding the s*** out of Empire as we speak ?
Where is the Lordz work on it ?
Where are the invitation on official forums such as TWCenter to help and CONTRIBUTE to JC's work ?

Frankly BDC, you perfectly know that Gunners work is much more quantitative then qualitative. Time and work is needed to do a clean and DEBUGGED map, a lot of time, believe me...
Nonetheless I have a very high esteem for Gunner and his work for the community. Better to play on some maps, than none right ? Smile

Smile

BDC a écrit:
P.S. Do change my account (honourary membership), I will have nothing to do with the grognards clan.

What in God's name are you trying to do ? Did anyone hurt you physically or hurt your feelings ? Why so much drama ?

I personally tested JC's last work. My opinion on it is that the difference between the vanilla version of Empire and JC's work (with the help of the community) is HUGE, or... shall I say ULTRA :dent: :affraid: .
His work on stats, costs, formations, blood effect and a myriad of other different touches to the game has made it ,inequivalently, the best way for now at least, to play the game with a very realistic behaviour of the troops on the battlefields.
Again, THE PRIMARY OBJECTIVE OF THIS MOD IS TO MAKE IT "ENJOYABLE" IN MULTI PLAYER.
Moreover, 90% of the work done on stats and unit costs are directly copied from the Napoleonic II: Total War mod done by the Lordz modding collective.
So what are you not happy about BDC ? (Are you in your menstruation period ? :pig: )
And while we're at it, shall we also delete any trace of your existence on this forum ? (sarcasm)

Razz

Razz

:

Dernière édition par [Grognard]_Liberalis le Mar 24 Mar 2009 - 0:30, édité 1 fois

_________________
"Une des pénalités dans le fait de refuser de participer à la politique, est qu'on fini d'être gouverné par des inférieurs". Platon

Braindead Colonel

Braindead Colonel: Membre Honoraire; Nombre de messages: 120
Date d'inscription: 27/10/2007

Message n°19

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par Braindead Colonel le Lun 23 Mar 2009 - 1:06

Heh, I find this very funny. I respond politely to insults, and the result? Even more inane posts Laughing

Laughing

Ah well, I have nothing to add.

Dernière édition par Braindead Colonel le Lun 23 Mar 2009 - 4:49, édité 1 fois

[Grognard]_Liberalis

[Grognard]_Liberalis: Chef d’État-Major; Nombre de messages: 4683
Age: 28
Localisation: Kremlin, Russie
Date d'inscription: 23/09/2006

Message n°20

Re: Grognard Mod Ideas and Discussion

Message par [Grognard]_Liberalis le Lun 23 Mar 2009 - 1:07

Not even a slight drop of fresh vodka ? :drunk:

EDIT: Could you please quote the insults that have offended you ?
I'd be happy to punish any dishonourable behaviour on our forums.

Smile

Smile

_________________
"Une des pénalités dans le fait de refuser de participer à la politique, est qu'on fini d'être gouverné par des inférieurs". Platon

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